Teamwork - A Better Way

Christian Napier
00:13 - 00:25
Well, good morning, everyone, and welcome to another episode of Teamwork, A Better Way. I'm Christian Napier, and I am joined by the festively fall-colored Spencer Horn. Spencer, how you doing? I am doing

Spencer Horn
00:25 - 00:40
great. As I said on Monday, I got thwarted doing my mountain trail to go see the colors. And so we're going to try to do that again. You and I talked about conference weekend, which Uh, is a big deal for us here.

Spencer Horn
00:40 - 00:53
And so, yes, I am. I am celebrating fall. Good to be with you. Uh, so, uh, so always excited to have more than one time a week where I get to see Christian that that's a good life when that happens.

Christian Napier
00:54 - 01:11
Yeah. You know, Jim Gaffigan, the comedian has a, a McDonald's, uh, routine that he does. And he talks about the French fries and how. After you eat the fries you look in the bag and you see the bonus fry like wow That's what we have this week.

Christian Napier
01:11 - 01:27
We have like the bonus fry of podcast, you know super excited to actually have multiple times in one week and We've got an amazing guest we do to end the week on on a high note. So Spencer Why don't you go ahead and do the introductions?

Spencer Horn
01:27 - 01:39
Yes, today we have Jana Franklin. I'm going to go ahead and put her on, on screen while I, while I talk about her in front of her face here. So Jana, you're coming to us from St. Louis, Missouri.

Spencer Horn
01:39 - 01:42
Is that right? If I recall. Yeah.

Jana Franklin
01:42 - 01:44
And it is not fall here at all.

Spencer Horn
01:45 - 01:46
It's not?

Jana Franklin
01:47 - 01:48
I am

Spencer Horn
01:48 - 01:53
flying there on Tuesday. I will be in St. Louis on Tuesday. So I'm going to check it out, make sure.

Spencer Horn
01:53 - 02:03
I was just there like last week and it was sure beautiful. I love going through the Missouri hills. I drove from Kansas City down to Jefferson City. Just such a beautiful country.

Spencer Horn
02:04 - 02:14
I lived in Missouri for a few years. God's country for sure. But we're so excited to have you. And Jenna is an owner of multiple franchises.

Spencer Horn
02:14 - 02:42
And she is somebody that is a, if I see this right, she's a serial entrepreneur. And so she has so much experience in business. And in 2023, she embarked on a new journey and started a virtual assistant A concierge virtual assistant company, and she's actually flying, Christian, to the Philippines next week to meet with what, 68 of your, of your team members there?

Jana Franklin
02:42 - 02:52
Yeah, I'm going to them this time. I'm going to hit the 3 Providences and hang out with them, do some team building, do some charity work, and do some strategy.

Spencer Horn
02:53 - 03:29
See, that's the kind of stuff that I'm excited to hear. We're going to talk to you and really help our listeners understand your motivation to start this because as an entrepreneur and also working in entrepreneur organizations like EO and I know women's groups that you support, there are so many challenges that entrepreneurs, business owners, business leaders face. in terms of burnout and just, you know, not letting go of control. And so you really have a lot of experience with that, which I know is one of the motivations for you starting this concierge VA.

Spencer Horn
03:30 - 03:53
We'll talk about that. But really the thing that I'm excited about, she's just incredible energy. We have a topic today, Christian, that you and I, when we were trying to figure out which one of the many things that she can talk about in terms of business, I think is really important. And that is breaking the mold of how women are rewriting the rules of entrepreneurship.

Spencer Horn
03:54 - 04:09
And I'm really excited to ask you a bunch of questions, and I know that Christian is as well. So let's jump right in. Start with how do you reshape the mold of entrepreneurship as a woman? What where

Jana Franklin
04:09 - 04:09
did

Spencer Horn
04:09 - 04:12
where does that come from? And what how did that get started for you?

Jana Franklin
04:14 - 04:34
Okay, you just started with the biggest question right you just went right for it Gosh, so I really think if you know it now that I'm in my 50s. I I really took a look. Yeah, I I'm in my fifties. Um, I, uh, I really think it comes for me.

Jana Franklin
04:34 - 04:54
It came from my upbringing. Um, I don't think I realized that probably until the last 10 years, maybe even five years. Um, my grandmothers, both my grandmothers, I, I grew up in Nebraska, very small state, very conservative state, very, you know, farm farm centric. The difference is growing up in Lincoln.

Jana Franklin
04:54 - 05:15
It was the Capitol. It was the university. So I do think that that allowed for the education and the support of women in business. My grandmother started a real estate company in the 50s supporting the university students.

Jana Franklin
05:16 - 05:35
She was buying single family homes and renting them out to college students. And my sister actually still runs that company to this day. And then my other grandmother, my maternal grandmother, was a piano teacher, an accountant. She was doing whatever needed to be done in her community.

Jana Franklin
05:35 - 05:53
And so I think that I just had very strong women in my life. My mother was a CPA. She had her own firm. And so I just saw that it was capable, that it was, capable, that women were capable to do this, that I didn't think anything different of it.

Jana Franklin
05:54 - 06:07
My dad had, I have sisters, I have a sister, that's it. And my dad always said, you know, girls can do anything boys can do and probably better. So I kind of always have that in the back of my head. Of course, I have all boys.

Jana Franklin
06:08 - 06:11
So I have to be careful

Spencer Horn
06:11 - 06:16
sometimes. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. That's a whole nother challenge.

Jana Franklin
06:17 - 06:53
It is, but you know what? I think I'm better off for having all boys, because I don't think I would have, given what's going on with girls in this day and age, I don't know if I have the patience to put up with some of the stuff that my friends put up with. But for me, I think it's definitely the upbringing that I had, but also I'm assertive. And so I To my husband's chagrin, I take risk and I kind of jump before I sometimes think about what I'm doing.

Jana Franklin
06:54 - 07:01
And it's bode well for me for the most part. But there has been times where I have definitely learned from those mistakes.

Spencer Horn
07:01 - 07:08
So this is exactly what I wanted. Thank you. I'm sorry that I went for the big thing, but I really meant to get this background. I love this.

Spencer Horn
07:08 - 07:33
And I think one of the things that I'm so excited about is, you know, so often we say, well, we don't want to go back to those old days. I love so many, I mean, in my family and my wife's family, there are so many great models of strong, and independent thinking and powerful women. And they raised great families. They run great business.

Spencer Horn
07:33 - 07:37
They worked in government and community. What I'm really interested

Jana Franklin
07:37 - 07:37
in

Spencer Horn
07:37 - 07:59
what you just said here is that you're assertive. I think you've had some great parenting and grandparenting, and that certainly contributed. You came to this earth with your own personality, but that probably contributed to it. I'm curious if, as a woman, there's an unfair response to assertiveness from a woman compared to a man.

Spencer Horn
08:01 - 08:07
Because in men, it's like, yeah, way to go, assertive. But when you're assertive, is there a different standard?

Jana Franklin
08:08 - 08:22
Oh, for sure. For sure. Yes. I was not always the first person to be picked in a lot of things.

Jana Franklin
08:24 - 08:39
It's probably still to this day, right? I think people will be like, hey, call Jana, she'll get it done. Um, but she's also going to tell you, you know, she's going to tell you how to, she's going to tell you what she thinks about it too. So be prepared for that.

Jana Franklin
08:40 - 09:10
Um, I, yes, it is to an unfair advantage. I think the difference for me is I, my degree is in fashion merchandising. I came in to, I was in retail, I was in fashion in, And I was in a very women-dominated industry. So for me, I think that also allowed for, I had very strong general merchandise managers over me, female, right?

Jana Franklin
09:10 - 09:41
And so for me, I did not encounter the boardroom conversations that you hear about still today that women are not taken as seriously in the room as men are. I don't encounter that. I have not encountered that for the most part in my positions in my world. However, I have encountered it in dealing with other entrepreneurs, men entrepreneurs more so.

Jana Franklin
09:41 - 10:14
I definitely see that men entrepreneurs, And I'm saying this very general in my experience there is a very big difference how men run their companies versus women. And so I do see that difference. But I've been in rooms where. if I'm saying something, it's maybe being considered emotional versus if a guy's saying it, it might be saying the exact same thing, it's not considered emotional.

Jana Franklin
10:15 - 10:28
And that is definitely, I think, where you hear these stories of women getting frustrated in the professional world because of that.

Christian Napier
10:31 - 11:08
I'd like to kind of riff on that a little bit. In the write-up for this, Janet, Spencer put in there that what we wanted to do is, among other things, is explore the evolving face of leadership. So in your career, having started out from, you know, in this fashion business to now, you're running multiple businesses. What does that mean to you, this evolving face of leadership, and how have you seen leadership change over the last several decades?

Jana Franklin
11:11 - 11:34
Well, I think it's really important to understand, in leadership, to understand the people you're, I do think, you know, my mother and I had this conversation a couple weeks ago. She is, She's called considered a traditionalist. She is not a baby boomer. She's the generation before baby boomer.

Jana Franklin
11:34 - 11:40
She asked me the other day what I was. She didn't remember. Um, I told her, um, I was telling her about it.

Spencer Horn
11:40 - 11:42
All three of us are Gen Xers here.

Jana Franklin
11:43 - 11:53
Yeah, exactly. Right. So I said to her. I was telling her a story about one of my general managers in the Jimmy Johns.

Jana Franklin
11:54 - 12:13
And I said to her, she goes, well, how are you going to handle that? And I said, well, I'm handling him different because he is a Gen Zer. And he takes information indifferently and he has to, has to, I have to explain more to him. I have to, I have to validate.

Jana Franklin
12:13 - 12:46
I have to, those are things that I have learned the hard way. as I have grown in my leadership roles, of that you can't talk and lead everyone the same way. And I think it's gotten more prevalent as the years have gone on, as you have more generations in the workforce right now, than you did prior. So, when I was in May Company, I was dealing with several generations, just maybe two, and I could talk to them, I could lead them the same way.

Jana Franklin
12:46 - 13:09
I didn't really have to change my delivery. I didn't have to wear different hats, and I could be kind of monotone. Now, I cannot. Before we got on this call today, I was down talking with one of my general managers at one of my stores because he's having some personality conflicts.

Jana Franklin
13:09 - 13:21
And so he and I talked about leadership and what that looks like and how I do it versus how he does it. And He's, you know, he's in his 20s. I'm in my 50s. So it's, we have a lot of differences.

Jana Franklin
13:21 - 13:47
So I, you have to change, you have to evolve with how the workforce is evolving, but more importantly, how they want to be led. And I think that for me, it was always lead by example, lead by example, lead by example, which I still do. But I can't tell, even my kids, my 18-year-old versus my 14-year-old, I cannot parent them the same way. It's the same thing in the workforce as a leadership.

Jana Franklin
13:47 - 14:08
You just, we cannot, I cannot talk to and lead my 40-year-old manager the same way I lead my 25-year-old manager. It just doesn't work. And so that is what I have learned over the time. And that's where I also am very interested in.

Jana Franklin
14:09 - 14:19
I have read some speaker, I've read some books, I have listened to some speakers, some TED Talks, whatever about that, about leading multiple generations.

Spencer Horn
14:32 - 14:58
You know, it's interesting. I think there has a lot changed. There may have been some generations, you know, decades ago, but it didn't matter because businesses were, you stayed with the same company for a long time. Today, there's so much pressure for, you know, if you, our generation stays with a company maybe two years, but the Gen Z you're talking about, if they don't like you, they're gone in two weeks.

Spencer Horn
14:59 - 15:02
And so, right?

Jana Franklin
15:01 - 15:05
Well, I don't even get two weeks sometimes. So yes. Right. So you know what

Spencer Horn
15:05 - 15:18
I'm talking about? And so that's, it's interesting because you have this natural assertive style. And what I heard you say is, you know, that that doesn't work in all circumstances. There's

Jana Franklin
15:18 - 15:18
a great

Spencer Horn
15:19 - 15:41
study by the Hay-MacBear Consulting Group, and they researched almost 4,000 executives worldwide. So all industries, all countries, race, gender didn't matter. And they identified six leadership styles. This is a study that's available and Daniel Goleman often refers to and identified six leadership styles.

Spencer Horn
15:42 - 15:51
Coercive and authoritative, probably come natural to you, right? Uh, and authoritative is actually a positive one. It's about creating vision. Here's where we're going.

Spencer Horn
15:51 - 16:05
I'm excited. Come with me. I mean, that's a, that's, um, but pace setting high standards, you know, striving, hardworking, probably also good for you. But the other three, and all three of those are very task-oriented.

Spencer Horn
16:05 - 16:34
The other three, affiliative, really getting people to work together and collaborate and support different departments, coaching, and democratic. Those are all people-oriented. And sometimes some personalities really struggle with those other three if they're naturally task-oriented, or if you're naturally very people-oriented, you struggle with being assertive, right, or authoritative,

Jana Franklin
16:34 - 16:34
or

Spencer Horn
16:34 - 16:54
coercive every once in a while if you need to be. And that's a very rare situation where you need that, but sometimes it's needed. And they found that the best leaders were able to adapt, not just occasionally, every single week being able to adapt. And so what I'm hearing you say is the leadership has to be very self-aware.

Spencer Horn
16:54 - 17:08
Leadership has to adapt to the environment, to the market, to the labor base, to the boardroom, to everything that's going on around based on what you're doing if you're wanting to be successful.

Jana Franklin
17:09 - 17:31
100%. I mean, I think this is probably where we get burned out, right, as leaders, because we are having to adapt. But they're also, I look at it like, yes, it's exhausting sometimes, but at the same time, the alternative is worse. You're

Spencer Horn
17:31 - 17:34
so right. Yeah. And you're right. It does take energy.

Spencer Horn
17:34 - 17:58
I guarantee you that it takes energy for you to be patient with that Gen Z-er. It's actually burning your energy. And those boys, to change your approach, it's like, okay, I need to go get a coffee or I need to take a little nap. But that's the problem is that we don't realize where the drain is coming from and actually plan for it.

Spencer Horn
17:59 - 18:01
I'd really like to hear your thoughts on that.

Jana Franklin
18:01 - 18:20
You are so hitting it on the head. So this person that I had to deal with this morning, I knew about this issue last week. I was out of town last week. So I let him know on Wednesday that I would be coming down to see him on Friday.

Jana Franklin
18:20 - 18:29
I didn't tell him when. I knew he had lunch rush, so I was gonna be aware of that and everything. I just said, look, I will be to you on Friday. I'm not ignoring you, blah, blah, blah.

Jana Franklin
18:29 - 18:50
And so, but I gave myself the grace to prepare myself to go down and have that conversation with him. So I mentally prepared myself because it's not because of the patience, right? That is not in my wheelhouse. My patience level is not there.

Jana Franklin
18:50 - 19:14
And I mean, I definitely have learned it with my children. So I try and take some of that with me into my management with Gen Zers, Gen Alphas. But I give myself the time and I give myself to put myself in that mindset to be able to go handle it and handle it very well. And I think that's what we don't do.

Spencer Horn
19:15 - 19:21
Yeah, that's wonderful. I know Christian, you got a comment. Can I just put up a comment we've had from a listener? Yep.

Spencer Horn
19:21 - 19:32
I don't know who this is. It says LinkedIn user, but, uh, thank you for chiming in and whoever this is says on and off the dance floor. Yes. Leaders must be who their followers need them to be.

Spencer Horn
19:33 - 19:44
Good leaders don't expect followers to be able to meet the leader where they are. Right. Cause they, maybe they haven't learned that yet. We're supposed to be the ones that, that know how to adapt to them.

Spencer Horn
19:45 - 19:46
Right. Thank you. Whoever that is.

Jana Franklin
19:47 - 20:06
Yeah, I mean, you know, I have teenagers, high schoolers, middle schoolers working in our stores and they're sponges. They want to know, they want to learn. And then you've got, you know, the college kid that's like, I just need the money. I'm here for the money.

Jana Franklin
20:06 - 20:20
And then you've got the people that are, I have a slew of moms who come and work lunch while their kids are in school. It's, yeah, they all need, I need to meet them, not them meeting me. That

Spencer Horn
20:20 - 20:22
is different than decades ago, don't you think, Christian?

Christian Napier
20:25 - 20:43
Yes, but at the same time, I think that there, and I'm curious to get your thoughts on this here, Janet. Are there certain principles that could be considered timeless? You know, I'm thinking about Stephen Covey's Seven Habits. Hard to believe that thing's been out like over 35 years, right?

Christian Napier
20:43 - 21:30
And when you're talking, the conversation that you guys have been having reminded me of one of those habits, which was seek first to understand, then to be understood, right? Developing empathy that takes effort It does take energy Sometimes it can be harder to understand people across generations because in many cases we don't even use the same vocabulary to describe our world but But the principle I think is a timeless principle. So I'm curious to hear from you Jana, you know as you look at leadership, although some things have evolved over time, are there certain principles that you have found that for you, they are bedrock and they are not changing?

Jana Franklin
21:32 - 21:40
Yes. For me, integrity. Integrity is a huge thing. You say you're going to do something, you do something.

Jana Franklin
21:40 - 22:00
If you, if you agree to it and you change the deal, you need to talk to the people who you made the deal with. That's, that's a big one for me. I think compassion is a big one. But Compassion with a sense of direction.

Jana Franklin
22:00 - 22:26
And what I mean by that is, you know, you do have, I do have employees that don't know what they want out of life and they're trying to figure it out. And I'm compassionate to a certain point, but there's still a job to do and you still need to show up because that's what you said you were going to do. So it ties back into integrity. But I think that.

Jana Franklin
22:27 - 22:39
For me, those are the two big ones. Respect. We all have things going on in our lives. We don't know what's going on in each other's lives.

Jana Franklin
22:39 - 22:56
We have to give that empathy and support them. But at the same time, we have to have those boundaries or guidelines. And I think that those, to me, are timeless. Lead by example is timeless.

Jana Franklin
22:57 - 23:18
I think lead by example is timeless. I mean, there are other franchisees in my franchise that don't understand why they have issues, but they're never present. And it's like, well, you know that saying, inspect what you expect? That's it, right?

Jana Franklin
23:18 - 23:26
And so you can't lead if you're not in the front.

Spencer Horn
23:36 - 23:52
Isn't that great for me to be able to take a little drink? But Jana, so what you're talking about right now is balancing empathy with accountability. So you talked about boundaries, right? You talked about that maybe your franchises don't have that problem.

Spencer Horn
23:52 - 24:00
So how are you creating those boundaries? How are you creating that accountability and balancing that with empathy? How do you do that?

Jana Franklin
24:03 - 24:11
Well, if you asked my team today, they'd probably say I'm doing it pretty good. If you asked my team yesterday, they'd probably say I suck Oh, but

Spencer Horn
24:11 - 24:14
there you go. You're human, right? Yes.

Jana Franklin
24:15 - 24:22
And I think that goes back to the compassion and the empathy, right? We are human. We are going to have issues. We don't know what's going on in each other's life.

Jana Franklin
24:23 - 24:40
However, here is the expectation of what you signed up for when you decided to work for us, and we're going to support you. But if you're not following the guidelines and the boundaries, then We can't help you. We can't support you. So I'm all for it.

Jana Franklin
24:41 - 24:51
Look, I have loaned money. I have bought cars. I've gotten cars stolen. So I sometimes have issues with boundaries as well.

Jana Franklin
24:52 - 25:17
But the accountability has to be there and you have to, the biggest thing I think is the consistency, right? You can be empathetic and you can have the accountability, but if you're not consistent from one person to another, it all goes out. It all gets thrown out the window because then favoritism starts coming into play. Whether you're doing it or not, that is the perception.

Jana Franklin
25:18 - 25:30
And so you have to stay consistent. And the only way to be consistent is the accountability and the boundaries, is to utilize those.

Spencer Horn
25:31 - 25:39
Yeah, I figured out who our commenter was. He had another comment. It's Robert Snyder. I don't know if you know Robert, but Robert says he's nodding.

Spencer Horn
25:40 - 25:48
Let's strive for high discipline and high empathy. Let's reject chaos and cruelty. Thank you, Robert, for joining the conversation.

Jana Franklin
25:50 - 26:28
You know, the other thing I wanted to say from something earlier is, you know, yes, I am a, in this, with the Jimmy Johns, I am a B2C business. Customers come in, pay for my service. My customers, for me, as the owner, is really my employees, for me, for this company, because I can't affect, well, I can to a certain extent, I can't affect my traffic. I can affect my employees because that's who's treating our customers.

Jana Franklin
26:28 - 26:29
Which

Spencer Horn
26:29 - 26:30
impacts traffic for your store.

Jana Franklin
26:31 - 26:49
Correct. And so it goes back to what he just said about the chaos and cruelty. You know, I also, I have to say this, you know, I don't have any employees that are going to work for free. I, and, but that's not an expectation either.

Jana Franklin
26:50 - 27:17
Like, I can't fathom having, and I know I have hired people that are like, Oh, I didn't get paid for the last two weeks with my former employee. I can't fathom that, you know, and minus the legality of it, but But that's compassion and empathy and also the leadership, right? That's integrity. You're here to work, you're going to get paid.

Jana Franklin
27:17 - 27:23
So I just think that we have to be careful. We have to understand who our customers are as leaders.

Christian Napier
27:25 - 27:54
Agreed. I want to come back to something, Janet, that you said earlier, and it kind of ties into this accountability concept. You mentioned when you were telling, kind of giving the background on yourself, that people referred you to say, hey, well, yeah, have her do it because she'll get it done, right? So execution is critical.

Christian Napier
27:55 - 28:20
And I am curious to know from you, where that quality of execution comes from, because there are a lot of people that have some great ideas, but at the end of the day, they just can't really deliver on their promises, right? And so, where does that come from? And in your view, what is the secret sauce to making sure that you deliver?

Jana Franklin
28:23 - 28:38
Oh my gosh. I'm not sure where it comes from. Um, so, you know, I used to be, I used to love multitasking, right? I am probably in my thirties, late thirties, forties.

Jana Franklin
28:38 - 28:44
I was like, Oh, I'm the queen of multitasking. I can do it. Okay. Um, that doesn't exist.

Jana Franklin
28:45 - 29:17
Uh, I come, I, I totally flipped the switch on that. Um, I was doing everything, but not doing anything good. And, and so I think for me, it's really about, If you're going to ask me to do something and I'm going to say yes and I'm going to do it, it's because I want to do it and because I believe in it. And so for me to do it, then I'm going to do it 100% because my name is on it and I'm representing it.

Jana Franklin
29:17 - 29:31
And so that to me is, that's where I get my attaboys. It's not so much the recognition. It's like, I did a job and I loved it and it was fun. It was something that I enjoyed.

Jana Franklin
29:31 - 29:51
I got great enjoyment out of it. So for me, doing it is the enjoyment. And so therefore, the delivery has to be spot on because I want, because to me, that is what I'm proud of. It doesn't mean that you have to say, Janet, good job, great job.

Jana Franklin
29:52 - 30:12
I don't need that. I really don't. I, My friends will tell you I am like, yeah, stop, you know, don't don't say that Please like you don't need to praise me. It was a it was a team effort or whatever So for me, it's it's it's that I did it and it took and it was successful And I can check the box that that's what success looked like for me.

Jana Franklin
30:13 - 30:18
And so that's for me where it comes from Forgot the second part of your question

Christian Napier
30:19 - 30:29
No, I think I think you really you nail the essence of it. So I appreciate you giving a little bit of insight, a little lens into what makes you tick.

Spencer Horn
30:31 - 30:43
Yeah, more comments. We appreciate that, Robert. We see them. We can't put them all on there, but you got to create a cadence of expectations or accountability is what I see him saying there.

Spencer Horn
30:44 - 30:56
Earlier on, you said that you noticed that there was a difference between how men run organizations and how women run organizations. What have you noticed?

Jana Franklin
30:57 - 31:05
Oh, boy. I'm always hesitant to say this to a mass

Spencer Horn
31:06 - 31:15
crowd. We need to talk about it. So 75% of the executives that I personally coach are women. So I've seen a lot.

Spencer Horn
31:15 - 31:34
And they appreciate having my perspective, but I've seen a lot of challenges that they have. And I know Christian is also super empathetic. This is an opportunity for us to increase our awareness, right? I mean, we're talking about how do we balance empathy and accountability?

Spencer Horn
31:35 - 31:47
Well, it starts with awareness. How do you adapt your leadership style if you don't even know how you're showing up? Do you even know how you're impacting your team because they're the ones that are impacting your customers? Are you doing that intentionally?

Spencer Horn
31:47 - 32:01
So when we have this conversation, this is not about gender beat-ups, right? This conversation is meant to drive awareness. I mean, am I wrong, Christian? No, spot on.

Spencer Horn
32:02 - 32:07
Spot on. So we're not looking for you to bash us. We're just looking, what are the differences? And what's good?

Spencer Horn
32:07 - 32:09
And what's bad? What could be better?

Jana Franklin
32:10 - 32:34
So here's what I would say. In my experience, I am finding more and more women are very relationship transactional driven. Almost community. I feel like men, and I'm being very broad, are very transactional.

Jana Franklin
32:36 - 32:53
Matter of fact. And I'm putting it in my ecosystem, right? It's really interesting. So in the Jimmy Johns, my management structure is mostly men.

Jana Franklin
32:54 - 33:28
virtual assistant agency, CEO, concierge, my structure is mostly women. So I do see the difference, but I also see the difference in dealing with other entrepreneurs, whether male or female, and also custom clients. And so what I have really, what I've really noticed is that Women more so that I have encountered are very relationship transactional. They're very like, hey Jana, this is awesome.

Jana Franklin
33:28 - 33:46
They take longer to make a decision. I've noticed they are really, it is a longer thought process. They're really weighing out the pros and cons. they, they are, I see a hesitancy more.

Jana Franklin
33:46 - 33:57
Whereas the men are very like, what's this going to do for me? What's this going to cost? What's this going to say? You know, what's this going to save me time and money and so forth.

Jana Franklin
33:57 - 34:16
And then it's like, yes, I'm going to make that decision. It's, they're coming from a two different decision-making process that I'm seeing. And I think, It translates sometimes as to they're not sure. they're more aggressive.

Jana Franklin
34:17 - 34:42
I think that's where the negativity thoughts come from, is that, no, I need to sit and noodle on this longer. I'm just not comfortable making this decision this quickly. Or, you know what, I want to talk to Spencer and Christian about this and see if they think it's a right idea and bounce it off of people before I make a decision. And I think that is important.

Spencer Horn
34:43 - 34:58
I 100% agree. Now let me show you something. This is a tool that I use to assess teams, okay? So I want you to look at the horizontal plane where it says productivity, left, low productivity, high productivity.

Spencer Horn
34:59 - 35:10
Productivity is all task related. Would you agree in what you're talking about? Now, you see high positivity and low positivity on this graph. That's relationship.

Speaker 4
35:10 - 35:11
So

Spencer Horn
35:11 - 35:26
I want you to think for just a moment. So what happens when you have an organization that is all task and no relationship? You're in that bottom right quadrant, right? It's low positivity and high productivity.

Spencer Horn
35:27 - 35:28
What is the problem with that?

Jana Franklin
35:31 - 35:37
You're a machine. You're just churning and burning. It doesn't matter who's sitting in that seat.

Spencer Horn
35:38 - 35:38
Right. I

Jana Franklin
35:39 - 35:41
mean, that's what I take away from it.

Spencer Horn
35:42 - 35:50
So what I want you to now look at is I want you to look at the top left. Low productivity, but high positivity. Now,

Speaker 4
35:51 - 35:52
what's

Spencer Horn
35:52 - 36:10
the problem with that? Nothing's getting done, but we all like each other, right? So what we need is we need a good balance of relationship and task, right? That's the challenge, that's the challenge that we have is how, where are we on that scale as an organization?

Spencer Horn
36:10 - 36:23
And there are times actually where we need to be task oriented and listen, we don't, We're introducing new software. There's a merger acquisition. You're opening in a new store. And sometimes we just got to grind it out, but we can't stay there.

Spencer Horn
36:24 - 36:46
On the other hand, there's times to celebrate and recognize and slow down and have a party, but we just can't stay there. So where we ultimately want to get is a great balance of both of those things, task and relationship. It is the relationship that enables the sustainability of doing the task in my experience.

Jana Franklin
36:48 - 36:48
So,

Spencer Horn
36:49 - 37:08
so if you're listening to this as a man, this is not a slam. It's, Hey, if you just go after it's how's this affect the bottom line, bottom line, bottom line, you're going to lose people and it's going to affect your bottom line because of the turnover. But if you slow down and say, listen, I've got to put some time into this relationship. you're going to keep those people, it's going to affect your bottom line.

Spencer Horn
37:08 - 37:11
Now, you can go too far in the relationship, just like we've shown, right?

Jana Franklin
37:12 - 37:20
Oh, yeah, because then they play you. I mean, that's what my, that's what my team would say. Oh, they're playing us. And I'm like, okay, no, this is what we built.

Jana Franklin
37:21 - 37:25
This is what you built. You built fun and no work. And this is what's happened now.

Spencer Horn
37:26 - 37:59
We're, gosh, there's so much that we could talk about, Christian. I want to shift gears into building teams. I think we've talked about building teams tangentially, but specifically, how do you balance the, you know, structure and flexibility, kind of what we've talked about, when managing remote teams across different businesses, right? Because you know, well, we'll get into this VA thing here in a second, but how do you manage and develop remote teams and really keep them succeeding?

Jana Franklin
38:02 - 38:35
Wow. You know, and maybe it's because I have multiple locations that I'm used to bouncing all around. I really think because of COVID and Zoom and FaceTime and everything that is allowed the workforce, whatever, industries to be global. I consider, I am a global, business owner.

Jana Franklin
38:35 - 39:10
I, you know, I don't, it doesn't, it doesn't phase me that I have a team in the Philippines. Um, I was on my director's call this morning on zoom with them, you know, um, and we WhatsApp and we use humble, which is similar to Slack. Like I feel just connected to them in the Philippines that I do to my store people. And, um, It takes a little bit more technology, but it doesn't have to be.

Jana Franklin
39:11 - 39:39
It doesn't have to feel disconnect. It's important for us to have support for them. I do have 16 people in the in-house support system that supports them, whether it's mental health, because you got to be careful when you're dealing with a remote too, that mental health starts to be a play. That's one of the reasons I'm going next week is to, you know, have fun with them and team building for all of us to get together.

Jana Franklin
39:40 - 40:06
They do stuff quarterly. We do team meetings quarterly or in July they went and met and I think some went up to the beach and some went sailing. I don't remember, but they all got together without me, but they get together and it's important that we're not just going again back to that box thing you had. We are spending time building relationships and getting to know them.

Jana Franklin
40:07 - 40:23
but on top of the work. And so if that's what you meant by building the team mechanically and setting them up was a complete different story than the actual managing of them.

Christian Napier
40:27 - 41:04
Coming back to the little chart thing that you showed up there, Spencer, and we've been talking about, You know, we look at those when it's framed that way, it looks like they're kind of opposing forces, but can't we look at those as complimentary, right? Like I use these tasks to build my relationships and I use my relationships to complete these tasks, right? Like, I don't mean that in a manipulative way. I mean that in a sincere way, but ultimately, The joy that we feel comes from the relationships that we have.

Christian Napier
41:04 - 41:29
We've talked about it before, Spencer, that Harvard study that's been going on for 80 plus years now, that's looking at things and taking into account all of those socioeconomic factors. The thing that really drives happiness is building meaningful relationships. Connections. we can use our work to build those meaningful relationships.

Christian Napier
41:29 - 42:02
I mean, heck, that's what we have. I mean, Spencer and I have been friends for over 20 years, meeting in a work environment, building a relationship that has persisted over time there. And so I'm curious to get your take, whether it is in-person or virtual, how you actually use the work to build the relationships and vice versa, how the relationships help you deliver the work?

Jana Franklin
42:02 - 42:27
Well, I think I do it differently for the Jimmy Johns than I do for the virtual assistants. The Jimmy Johns, it is me being present in the store. I, I cleaned the grossest thing first before I let anyone else clean it. If I'm, or I'm, I'm dealing with the.

Jana Franklin
42:28 - 42:29
I called that the

Spencer Horn
42:29 - 42:31
bathroom principle, by the way.

Jana Franklin
42:31 - 42:44
Okay, good. I now know what it's called. With the virtual assistants, I mean, so I go in and have fun. I take off some of the, I try and make it, I try and add levity to it.

Jana Franklin
42:44 - 42:54
I try and be like, look, it's not as bad as you guys think it is, right? It's like, woo, let's just have fun. You know, it's going to be a crazy day, guys. Let's have fun.

Jana Franklin
42:54 - 43:06
That's all we can do. All we can do is put our head down and have fun, right? And if I'm not freaking out that we're running out of bread, then you guys shouldn't be freaking out. Right.

Jana Franklin
43:07 - 43:22
And so I think it's just adding that to that and trying to build goodwill, the goodwill. I mean, I do other things we do, you know, we, we do a newsletter, we do employee of the month. I do birthday, $10 Walmart gift cards for even people I've not met. Right.

Jana Franklin
43:22 - 43:38
I just, I send them out and I thank them for being with us. Um, VA's a little bit different. Because I do all the interview, I do all the final interviews. So I've got to know them before they've even potentially been hired.

Jana Franklin
43:39 - 43:51
a lot of our clients are, most of our clients are referrals. And so I've gotten to know them. And I've gotten to know the people that have referred us. And so for me, that's even more relationship-driven.

Jana Franklin
43:51 - 44:32
And because to understand as what they want and their needs and their, what, where they want to live in there, what lane they want to live in, what's their passion and what do they want to unload? Then the same with the VAs. Personality fits are 50%, if not more important to us in this company, then, then the Jimmy Johns, obviously. And so for me, it is, making sure that both parties involved feel that they're equal partners.

Jana Franklin
44:32 - 44:43
And then, hey, by the way, we're equal partners, we're supporting you. And so I think that's how I try to add to the levity for them.

Spencer Horn
44:54 - 45:15
Hey, Christian, we need to take a little bit of time to mention our sponsor. And then I've got a question that hopefully will be good for us. But this tool that I was sharing with you, that graph really comes from how do you manage your teams and identify what the culture? You have different teams.

Spencer Horn
45:16 - 45:37
We're talking about virtual teams. We have cross-functional teams. project teams, but really to find out where they are on that productivity, positivity scale. And there's seven elements of productivity, you know, from team leadership, resources, decision-making, you even talked about the time it takes for decision-making, all the way through alignment, goals, and all those sorts of things.

Spencer Horn
45:37 - 46:07
And then there's seven elements of positivity. That's trust, respect, camaraderie, communication, the ability to disagree and do it well, valuing diversity and optimism. All of those things, those are what we're measuring and seeing where they are with that so that we can really identify how, you know, what, where they need to move to. And so we have this, this is brought to us by Team Coaching International.

Spencer Horn
46:08 - 46:38
And it's a, it's an amazing tool that really measures, you know, where the team is at and where they need to go to be, to be successful. And so we're offering, through Team Coaching International, a free team diagnostic, what's called a team leader view. So it's not a true diagnostic in the sense that everybody takes it, but You as the team leader take it and you get a kind of a real sense from your perspective of how the team is doing. So we invite, if you're watching this, take a picture of that, ask for the team diagnostic.

Spencer Horn
46:38 - 47:02
If you're listening, we'll put the link in the show notes. Okay, so back to business. Here's a question I have. You know, what systems or mindset has helped you to kind of transition from a solopreneur to a scalable leader, you know, of multiple businesses?

Spencer Horn
47:03 - 47:25
I mean, what's behind this question is what are the challenges that so many entrepreneurs face that prevent them from making that jump? And I know it has something to do with accepting help. That's why you started this concierge company. So what are some of those things that really helped you to move up that scale to where you are today?

Jana Franklin
47:27 - 47:42
Oh, boy. For me, wearing too many hats. Overwhelmness. Being on the hamster wheel versus not being on the hamster wheel.

Jana Franklin
47:44 - 47:58
How was I going to grow my company if I was constantly putting out fires? If all I was doing was putting out fires, obviously something was not working. It was exhausting. I was not happy.

Jana Franklin
47:58 - 48:15
I was really not doing what I want to be doing. So it was like, why am I in business if I'm spending my time doing everything I don't want to be doing? Because I think, you know, everyone thinks owning a business is awesome, right? Because you have the flexibility, you're your own boss.

Jana Franklin
48:16 - 48:51
You're really not, your employees are your boss or your customers. And so I really took the time and this is where we really, I focus with CEO concierge is, I don't have to do it all, nor am I good at all of it. And I think the faster we realize that, the faster we can unload that and then you're happier and you're spending the time growing your business where you want to be growing and you have people that want to be growing it and that like to be doing those tasks that you're not good at or don't want to be doing.

Jana Franklin
48:52 - 49:14
They love doing that. So put the people, it's the right seats in the right spot, right? So put the people that can do it and you get to spend the time doing what you're good at and growing your company in the way you can grow it. And you have the people cohort to whoever growing your company with you, but doing what you don't like, what you're not good at.

Jana Franklin
49:14 - 49:24
And I think that's what it took me sitting down and being like, this isn't working. What do I need to do? And that's what it took.

Spencer Horn
49:25 - 49:28
So basically you got to a point where you were sick and tired of being sick and tired.

Jana Franklin
49:30 - 49:52
Yep. And in fairness, and I was talking to a client yesterday, a female client, And I've had this conversation with my family more recently this summer about women, about my mental load as the woman of the house who comes home and works a full day at work and then comes home and everyone's asking me what's for dinner.

Spencer Horn
49:54 - 49:55
Jimmy John's.

Jana Franklin
49:56 - 50:13
Well, trust me, last night it was Jimmy John's. I was not doing anything. I was like, I'm done, this day has been long. So, And my son rides his bike up and gets a sandwich and rides his bike home because we, one of our stores is in my neighborhood.

Jana Franklin
50:14 - 50:38
So intentionally, by the way, my husband will tell you, we bought this store so we can donate all of our money to all the schools in our school district. So anyways, but I'm going off tangent. But I will tell you that, and this is where I like to sit because this is the hat I wear, right? Is that for me as a female business owner, I do have to wear more hats.

Jana Franklin
50:39 - 50:47
I do have the flexibility. My husband works full time. He's a stock analyst. He does not have the flexibility.

Jana Franklin
50:47 - 51:04
So I could have a day of calls and a day of work, but guess what? I'm the one taking my 14 year old to the orthodontist at 3.30. So I'm still carrying the personal load as well. So for me, it was, I can't carry it all.

Jana Franklin
51:05 - 51:23
And I had to, I brought my virtual assistant on to help me deal with the stuff that I just couldn't, I did not want to deal with anymore. I wasn't good at it. It was painful to me to deal with it. I'd rather be where I need to be and she's good at it.

Jana Franklin
51:24 - 51:33
So she's been with me five years. Like we have an understanding, she knows. So that's what it took. It took for me to be like, this is what I have to take off my plate.

Jana Franklin
51:33 - 51:43
This is what I want on my plate. This is what I want to add to my plate. I mean, I'm not saying I didn't add things cause I did, but it was stuff I wanted to add. It wasn't being forced upon me.

Christian Napier
51:46 - 52:20
Well, Spencer, I've got one question, uh, to kind of wrap up on my thoughts, uh, before you ask your final questions and get to our lightning round. My question for you simply is, where is all this headed? So we've seen things change from the time that your grandmothers and mother were running real estate companies and CPA firms back in the 50s and 60s and 70s to where you are today, operating global companies with virtual assistants. I mean, that wasn't a thing.

Christian Napier
52:20 - 52:34
But coming back to Kavi, beginning with the end in mind, where do you think this goes from here? Like in the next five, 10 years, what are you seeing? Where do you think it's gonna be? Where's all this gonna be heading?

Jana Franklin
52:37 - 53:04
So I had a conversation this week, a couple of different times with different people about AI. Um, because I have been asked numerous times this last month. So I was like, okay, what's going on? Um, how is AI going to disrupt my industries, whether it's Jimmy John's or the virtual assistant, how is automation going to interrupt my industries?

Jana Franklin
53:05 - 53:27
And I, I'm taking the approach of embracing it. You got to embrace change. It happens every day. I think that there's so much uncertainty right now with the AI because it changes so much every day.

Jana Franklin
53:27 - 53:50
And you can go down a rabbit hole on educating yourself, but then the next day it's going to change. So I think you have to be aware of the implications in your industry. So for me, the implications in the virtual assistant is AI. How's that going to, how's that going to change for me?

Jana Franklin
53:50 - 54:16
So for me, that's where I look at and how can I bring that into our company? And then for the Jimmy Johns, it's, it's harder right now because we are affected by the tariffs. I don't think, I mean, everyone's affected by the tariffs. So the uncertainty there is, I think, actually bigger because I just don't know where we're heading.

Jana Franklin
54:16 - 54:45
And the other part of that is I also have the corporate arm because I am a franchisee. So if corporate decides to do something that as a franchisee, I might not agree with, I probably don't have a choice. And so I have to, I write a fine line on that and maneuver where I can to have some autonomy. So I don't know if I'm answering your question right, Christian, but that's how I'm approaching it.

Jana Franklin
54:45 - 55:17
As far as overall industry is, as far as entrepreneurs, I think that there's so much opportunity in the world, in the U.S., wherever you are, if you have an idea, really think about it, because probably other people are thinking about it, too. There's a reason why you keep coming up with this idea. I've had several ideas. I've tried to launch them.

Jana Franklin
55:17 - 55:32
In fact, I tabled one in 2017, and a lady I talked to in St. Louis launched an app, not similar, but has some nuances. And I sent her my whole pitch deck. I said, Here, I'm done.

Jana Franklin
55:32 - 55:40
The company's gone. But what you said to me about where you're heading, here. And she's like, Holy cow, you're giving me the whole pitch deck. I go, I'm not going to do it.

Jana Franklin
55:40 - 56:04
By all means, take my research, my study, and use some of this if you decide. I think we have to get a little bit more open-minded about sharing stuff if we're not going to do it. Collaboration to help people grow. And so I think, I hope that we see more female entrepreneurs in the next five to 10 years.

Jana Franklin
56:05 - 56:10
I feel like I'm meeting a lot of female entrepreneurs, but that's also kind of the world I live in.

Spencer Horn
56:21 - 56:38
Well, I have Christian just, uh, I'm going to wrap my final question into the lightning round so that we can get through it. Cause, um, I, we go through it just like one, you know, one word or short one sentence answers. Okay. And we're going to go really fast.

Spencer Horn
56:38 - 56:46
You ready? So there's going to be 11 of them now, since my last questions, here it is. What's one thing women entrepreneurs need to stop apologizing for in business.

Jana Franklin
56:49 - 56:52
I would just say we need to stop apologizing, period.

Spencer Horn
56:53 - 56:57
Empathy or efficiency? You can only pick one to start a company with. Which one and why?

Jana Franklin
57:00 - 57:08
Efficiency, because if you're starting, it's just you. And things aren't going to get done if you don't do it.

Spencer Horn
57:10 - 57:11
First thing you do every morning?

Jana Franklin
57:17 - 57:18
Brush my teeth.

Spencer Horn
57:19 - 57:22
Your go-to podcast or book for leadership inspiration?

Jana Franklin
57:25 - 57:36
Oh my God, this changes all the time. Gosh, I should have had these questions ahead of time.

Spencer Horn
57:37 - 57:42
No, this is why we throw you on the spot. It's okay, just pick one. Seven

Jana Franklin
57:42 - 57:46
habits. I'm going to go with Adam Grant right now.

Spencer Horn
57:46 - 57:50
Yeah, he's awesome. Most underrated leadership skill? I think we talked about it, but.

Jana Franklin
57:53 - 57:54
Lead by example.

Spencer Horn
57:56 - 57:58
Biggest myth about being a virtual assistant?

Jana Franklin
58:03 - 58:05
That they can't do it, that they don't have the skill set.

Spencer Horn
58:06 - 58:09
Good, you know, because a lot of them are foreign, right? And

Jana Franklin
58:09 - 58:09
that

Spencer Horn
58:09 - 58:16
was actually a question I wanted to ask you if there's, so that's good. Favorite tech tool you can't live without? We're talking about AI.

Jana Franklin
58:18 - 58:32
I'm going to have to go with my Google calendar. I used to be a paper planner. Like I had my paper planner carried in my handbook and now it's like my calendar is my calendar.

Spencer Horn
58:32 - 58:34
Have you integrated that with AI yet?

Jana Franklin
58:35 - 58:38
I'm working on integrating it with reclaim.

Spencer Horn
58:40 - 58:40
Okay.

Jana Franklin
58:40 - 58:41
Reclaim AI.

Spencer Horn
58:42 - 58:46
Good for you. Okay. One thing every CEO should stop doing immediately.

Jana Franklin
58:50 - 58:51
things they don't like.

Spencer Horn
58:52 - 58:56
If your leadership style were a movie, what genre would it be?

Jana Franklin
58:57 - 59:04
Oh my God, it's gonna be rom-com.

Spencer Horn
59:04 - 59:08
A funny, romantic comedy, yes. Coffee or tea during crunch time?

Jana Franklin
59:10 - 59:11
Tea, tea, tea, tea, tea.

Spencer Horn
59:12 - 59:16
Awesome. Finish the sentence, great leadership starts with?

Jana Franklin
59:20 - 59:21
direction.

Christian Napier
59:22 - 59:27
That's it, Christian. Wow. Okay. That was awesome.

Christian Napier
59:27 - 59:46
Uh, and Janet, this has been a really insightful conversation and so grateful to have you here with us. If people want to learn more about the CEO concierge, uh, or they want to learn more about, uh, you know, women entrepreneurs or anything else related to this topic, what's the best way for people to connect with you?

Jana Franklin
59:48 - 1:00:09
Yeah. Janna, J-A-N-A, at ceoconcierge.com. Through our website, through any social media, LinkedIn, I'm there. I would also say, if people want to talk to me about being a franchisee, I also have conversations with people that are also looking at maybe buying a franchise and what not to do and what to do, because we've done them both.

Christian Napier
1:00:10 - 1:00:19
That's fantastic. My son is a franchisee. Maybe I'll have you connect with him. That's great.

Jana Franklin
1:00:20 - 1:00:22
We can share pain stories and good

Christian Napier
1:00:22 - 1:00:29
stories. That's right. You can share war stories. Spencer, you've been helping organizations build high-performing teams.

Christian Napier
1:00:30 - 1:00:36
For decades, you've been coaching individuals to become effective leaders. How can people contact you?

Spencer Horn
1:00:36 - 1:00:52
Favorite way is LinkedIn. Message, you know, just go to Spencer Horn and message me there. And Christian, you know, I just, I want so many people to know what you do for your clients and organizations, what you've done for me. How can people find you and just get to know you

Christian Napier
1:00:52 - 1:00:57
better? Just look me up on LinkedIn, Christian Napier. You'll find me there. Happy to connect.

Christian Napier
1:00:57 - 1:00:58
He's an

Spencer Horn
1:00:58 - 1:01:09
innovator. He's an innovator with technology and uses it in very, very powerful ways to help companies tell the stories of their organization. So you got to reach

Christian Napier
1:01:09 - 1:01:15
out to him for that. Well, thank you, Spencer. And thank you, Janet. And thank you, viewers and listeners.

Christian Napier
1:01:16 - 1:01:22
We're so grateful to have you join us on our journey. Please like and subscribe to our podcast. And we'll catch you again soon.